Thursday, August 20, 2009

Sean Hannity's Lies

Bob Enyart, Pastor of Denver Bible Church, and now spreading the truth on Denver's radio airwaves at KGOV had Gregg Jackson on as a guest this evening. As you all may well know Mr. Jackson is the leading author of "Conservative Combacks to Liberal Lies" and has been spreading the truth regarding our countries fallacious "conservatives" and "pro-family" organizations such as the Massachusetts Family Institute and Focus on the Family.

Mr. Enyart and Mr. Jackson discuss how Sean Hannity, one of those "conservative pro-lifers", has been spreading lies regarding former MA Governor Mitt Romney's socialist health care bill. The bill includes a $50 tax-subsidized co-pay to slaughter children, better known as abortion, as a healthcare benefit. Proof Source: Healthcare Benefit.
Mr. Jackson called into the Sean Hannity radio show yesterday to ask Sean why he continues to support Romney eventhough the former governor supports abortion. Sean just could not answer the question.
Click HERE to listen.

14 Comments:

Blogger The New Village Atheist said...

“The bill includes a $50 tax-subsidized co-pay to slaughter children, better known as abortion, as a healthcare benefit.”

Wow Scia, once again you are attempting to stir up emotional commentary. I could have even been on your side until you started writing that kind of crap.

11:00 PM, August 22, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Right-wing shill.

5:53 AM, August 23, 2009  
Blogger SCIA said...

Ken,

What part were you 'on my side'?

6:23 PM, August 23, 2009  
Blogger The New Village Atheist said...

“What part were you 'on my side'?”

The tax subsidy. Leave my tax dollars alone please. If a girl is raped and her attacker is unable to pay for it; I’ll be happy to. If giving birth will endanger the life of the mother, I’ll pay for an abortion there too. If a woman is using abortion as birth control she can pay for it herself; maybe next time she’ll see that condoms are cheaper.

10:57 AM, August 24, 2009  
Blogger SCIA said...

Ken,

You said:

"If a girl is raped and her attacker is unable to pay for it; I’ll be happy to."

Killing the baby who resulted from that rape doesn't make the woman any less raped.

Is killing the baby before it is born worth it because the woman won't have to look at the baby on a daily basis and be reminded of the horrible crime committed against her? NO! How about letting the poor baby live and putting it up for adoption? That is better than burning it alive in its amniotic sac via saline abortion, or having it chopped to bits via a dilation and curettage (D&C) abortion.

You said:

"If giving birth will endanger the life of the mother, I’ll pay for an abortion there too."

I was acquainted with a pro-life doctor (OB/GYN)who once told me over lunch that she never knew of a case where an abortion was necessary to save the life of the mother. I asked her pointedly "What about the case of ectopic pregnancy?", and she said flatly "Not even then." then went on to tell me what treatment modality would be used to save BOTH.

You said in the blog post titled "Medically Appropriate":

"I don’t like abortion. I wish we could live in a world where they weren’t necessary..."

Why do you wish this?

You also asked in this post:

"When does a clump of cells become a “baby”? "

1. When do you say a "clump of cells" become a baby? Why?

2. In using the term "clump of cells" do you mean to impute a non-or less-than-human status to the unborn child? Why?

3. When the "clump of cells" as you describe it becomes (by your definition) a baby, does it (i.e. the baby) have an inalienable right to life? Why or why not?

You also state in the post:

"...when those protesters had no clue as to why the women were going there in the first place."

The above statement implies a belief in situational ethics and moral relativism. If unborn children are in fact unborn children and entitled as such to the inalienable right to life and are innocent of any wrongdoing in the eyes of any of the jurisdictions in which they live (particularly for which the proscribed penalty is death) then abortion is murder and the reason why the mother facilitated the murder and the doctor committed it is orthogonal to the point that abortion is murder.

You continue to say:

"Since that time it has only hardened as I KNOW that abortions are sad, but necessary."

By what standard do you determine they are "sad"?

You also say:

"They’ll be forced into the back alleys instead of doctor’s offices."

Forced? Who says they MUST have an abortion? What a disingenuous line. Look at deaths from "safe, legal" abortions, as well as the long-term non-lethal effects.

You said:

"Abortions will only stop when people stop making mistakes."

Tripping on a rug is a mistake. Typing a 'w' when you meant to type an 'e' is a mistake. Thinking that the word "gift" on a package arriving from Germany connotes something good is a mistake (i.e. "gift" in German means "poison" in English).... Nobody mistakenly has an abortion.

7:21 PM, August 26, 2009  
Blogger The New Village Atheist said...

“Killing the baby who resulted from that rape doesn't make the woman any less raped.”

True; but forcing a woman to endure the 9 months of pregnancy is only prolonging the crime against her. It was her body that was violated in the first place; it should be her choice as how to proceed. I find it reprehensible that you would impose upon her your will and moral judgments; that is also rape.

“Is killing the baby before it is born worth it because the woman won't have to look at the baby on a daily basis and be reminded of the horrible crime committed against her? NO!”

How would you know? Have you ever been raped? Have you ever felt someone violating and entering you without your will? If not than you have absolutely no frickin clue what you are talking about!

“How about letting the poor baby live and putting it up for adoption?”

How about you and the other pro-lifers out there minding your own frickin business?

“I was acquainted with a pro-life doctor…”

Well medical advances have come along haven’t they? I don’t know what was wrong with my manager’s pregnancy, but that was 23 years ago. Maybe advances in medical technology have made those needs irrelevant. If so; that’s wonderful.

I said: I don’t like abortion…

Scia asked: Why do you wish this?

Because abortion is a failure. Not the medical procedure, but what brought about the pregnancy in the first place. It might have been a failure to prevent a rape, possibly a failure of birth control, a failure to control your emotions, or maybe even a failure to confront one’s own consequences.

1 I do not understand your question.

2 Yes, after conception it is just 2 cells. One sperm and one egg. Then the cells divide for some time while it moves down the fallopian tube and then if all continues to go well it will attach itself to the endometrium. I don’t claim to have the medical knowledge necessary to determine when a zygote (clump of cells) actually becomes a “baby”. I doubt you do either. Let the medical professionals sort it out.

3 No, it does not have the ability to survive outside the womb. And the womb by definition belongs to another person. And in this country one person can not be a slave to another.

“The above statement implies a belief in situational ethics and moral relativism.”

Is it okay to lie sometimes? That should answer your “situational ethics and moral relativism.”

“By what standard do you determine they are "sad"?”

By my own personal standards.

“Forced? Who says they MUST have an abortion?”

If I am driving along a highway and come along a gas station that is miles from the next one and I need to use a bathroom REALLY REALLY BAD, but the man tells me I can not use the bathroom did he force me to pee my pants?

“Look at deaths from "safe, legal" abortions, as well as the long-term non-lethal effects.”

Look at the deaths from illegal non-sterile abortions.

“Nobody mistakenly has an abortion.”

Nobody mistakenly has a cast put on their arm either.

8:31 PM, August 26, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As long as the right-wing fringenuts are fixated on Romney, the Commonwealth is a safer, healthier, and happier place to live.

7:40 PM, August 30, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Abortion is murder. It is a crime of covenience.

Ever hear of adoption?

Don't play the weak argument cards for murder of an unborn child, they're all unadulterated bunk!!!

5:04 PM, September 01, 2009  
Blogger The New Village Atheist said...

“Abortion is murder. It is a crime of covenience.”

Oh sure; it’s just so simple for you isn’t it? Go ahead and call it murder or the slaughter of babies or even a modern day holocaust without addressing any part of the real issue.

“Ever hear of adoption?”

Sure I have. In the last election in Arkansas adoptions were outlawed to any family that is not made up of a married man and woman. So even though there are currently tens of thousands of children nationwide waiting for an adoption most will not be due to fear of gay people. So this “there’s always adoption” argument is BS. Tens of thousands of children will never be adopted.

“Don't play the weak argument cards for murder of an unborn child, they're all unadulterated bunk!!!”

Which of my arguments was bunk? Were you saying that all of my arguments were “unadulterated bunk!!!”? So just to be clear you believe a girl who is raped and becomes pregnant from that rape should once again have her body subjected to another’s will? What kind of person does that make you? Her body had been used by one person against her will and so you take it upon yourself to rape (yes I said rape) her will for your own purpose? Is her life worth less than the “baby” growing inside her? Oh I just love all you Christian people and your god. You like to claim that the bible is the inerrant word of god and women seem to be just property in that book. The victims of rape are forced to marry their attacker in that “good book” of yours. Women must be silent and not be suffered to teach a man. Women are property in the bible and once a woman/girl gets pregnant (no matter how the pregnancy came to be) they are property once again. It’s no wonder that so many rape victims hide the fact that they were violated. The victim gets told that she must repent; that she dressed too suggestively or she led him on as if the men are unable to control themselves.

1:29 AM, September 02, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wasn't addressing any of your comments. You are a vain one aren't you?

Abortion is murder. It is the taking of a life that cannot defend itself. It is murder. I remember a case where a pregnant woman was murdered and subsequently the growing *tissue* inside her ceased to live for the same reason the mother died. All of a sudden that growing *tissue* became a baby and now it was proclaimed a double homicide!

The pro-death group wants it both ways. It's a baby or it's not. If killing the baby inside the womb by an assalient is murder then killing the baby prior to birth, by decision by the woman by a physcian is also murder. There are no exceptions.

You have no idea what my religious beliefs are. I have not stated them. You automatically think that everyone not in favor of the murder of the unborn and and same sex marriage are Christian. How very wrong you are.

8:11 PM, September 02, 2009  
Blogger SCIA said...

Ken,

You said:

"True; but forcing a woman to endure the 9 months of pregnancy is only prolonging the crime against her. It was her body that was violated in the first place; it should be her choice as how to proceed."

So, it is O.K. for the women whose body WAS violated to therefor murder her unborn child because she will have to think about why she has the baby for the next 9 months. Wow, I wish my wife had an attitude like that when she was pregnant with her second or third child. If the first child was acting up and being rotten and the thought of another little sh*t being born got to her maybe she should of gone to the clinic and called it quits. Boy, the freedoms we have in this country. Murder someone out of selfishness. I love America!!

I asked:

“How about letting the poor baby live and putting it up for adoption?”

You responded with the childish response of:

"How about you and the other pro-lifers out there minding your own frickin business?"

This is a legitiment question Ken, but as I can see you can not answer it. Typical.

I asked:

"When do you say a "clump of cells" become a baby (AKA LIFE)? Why?"

Well, having a degree in the health field and working on a nursing degree I know for a fact that when an ovum (egg) and a sperm unite, a fertilized egg or zygote is created. This zygote begins LIFE as a single cell with a complete set of genetic material, 23 chromosomes from daddy and 23 chromosomes from mommy. Each human begins LIFE as a single cell called a zygote. An egg becomes fertilized at conception. LIFE therefore begins at conception.

I asked the following in which you answered childishly again:

“Forced? Who says they MUST have an abortion?”

Wow Ken, the truth really brings the elementary child out in you doesn't it? Sorry, the truth stings sometimes.

8:30 PM, September 02, 2009  
Blogger The New Village Atheist said...

Anonymous:

“Wasn't addressing any of your comments. You are a vain one aren't you?”

Well ummmm; whose comments were you addressing?

“If killing the baby inside the womb by an assalient is murder then killing the baby prior to birth, by decision by the woman by a physcian is also murder. There are no exceptions.”

No exceptions eh? None at all? So from that I gather slavery is also acceptable?

“You have no idea what my religious beliefs are. I have not stated them.”

You’re right, I do not KNOW if you are a Christian, but I’d bet my last dollar you are not an atheist.

“You automatically think that everyone not in favor of the murder of the unborn and and same sex marriage are Christian. How very wrong you are.”

No; I do not think that everyone that favors “the murder of the unborn and and same sex marriage” are Christian… Muslims also share those beliefs. You’re in good company now aren’t you?


Scia:

“So, it is O.K. for the women whose body WAS violated to therefor murder her unborn child because she will have to think about why she has the baby for the next 9 months.”

YES! It is HER body. No one or nothing has more of a right to that body than her. Not you; not the embryo, and not the state.

“Murder someone out of selfishness.”

You call claiming one’s body as their own as selfish? If your wife got pregnant choosing to get pregnant and then didn’t like the kids she should have made you use a condom or tell you to keep that one eyed monster of yours away from her. If that’s too much for her to handle then she should face the consequences. If she chooses to have an abortion she can pay for it herself. That would and should be between her and her physician. It’s her body; not mine or yours, or the state’s.

“You responded with the childish response of:”

So asking you to keep your nose in your own life and out of the lives of others is childish? No wonder you can so easily ingratiate yourself into the lives of gay people and women; their lives belong to you and what you wish.

“This zygote begins LIFE as a single cell with a complete set of genetic material, 23 chromosomes from daddy and 23 chromosomes from mommy.”

So, would the plan B pill also be an abortion?

“LIFE therefore begins at conception.”

I like grass in my front lawn even though the environmentalists say I should have desert landscaping. So sometimes I’ll plant grass seed on my lawn, are the birds performing a “grass” abortion when they take the seeds from my lawn? Those seeds have all they need for life too.

“I asked the following in which you answered childishly again:”

Oh no, I guess I’ll go sit in the corner and suck my thumb. Wait… You didn’t bother to respond to any of my points either Scia; tell your wife to use baby powder; it prevents diaper rash.

To anonymous and Scia; it seems we both have very opposing viewpoints. I believe a woman’s body belongs to her and her alone, while you both have the opinion that if she gets pregnant her body belongs to the child growing inside of her. I do not have any medical training while Scia does so I must acquiesce to his statement that life begins at conception. However I do not believe that a person should be forced to use their body as an incubator if she does not wish so. And no amount of calling it murder will change my mind. If you wish to have a serious discussion I will try but please leave out the emotional appeals. I find it very difficult to discuss this when clinics must have bulletproof glass and armed security because too many times someone who shares your beliefs decides that the murder of a doctor is okay while the murder of an “unborn baby” is not.

1:34 AM, September 03, 2009  
Anonymous omd said...

Thought I'd drop in and see what's going on. Don't have much time these days as work has gotten very busy. That's a good thing I guess.

Romney's a jerk and is more Democrat than Republican. He left the state in very bad shape. Deval Patrick is only making it worse.

The state of Massachusetts gives healthcare to illegal immigrants without a concern but when my son applied for healthcare he was told to produce 3 forms of identifaction to prove he's a citizen.

Abortion - the body inside the woman is not her body. It is a living organism within her and she has no rights over that life she 'carries.' It is not her body but the body of another who has the same rights as every human. As Scia says,when 'officially' conceived the egg has a full set of genetic markers. The egg transforms from dormant to living.

When one aborts a baby it is murder. How can it be called justifiable? It cannot!

That's why anonymous is right in saying it is a crime of convienence. Mankind can sit around all day long making laws that make crimes legal so it suits their purpose. BUT mankind cannot justify themselves to God. For that we need Jesus.

Know up front that many who are not Christians will get angry with you for even mentioning the name of Jesus Christ. This anger stems from the fact that those who are lost, deep, deep, down, know that something is missing in their life.

This is why people get involved with drugs, with alcohol, with gambling,
with sex, or become addicted to work and success.

This is why so many people get lost in cults and the false religions of this world.

There is a void in a person's life that subconsciously they know is there and are trying to fill.

This void can ONLY be filled by reconnecting to God.

The Good News today is that God loves us so much, He sent Jesus to die for OUR sins so that by putting our faith in Him, we could be reconnected with God and that void in our life would be filled.

6:45 AM, October 01, 2009  
Blogger The New Village Atheist said...

Wow, this place has been dead for a month then Omd stops by.

“Deval Patrick is only making it worse.”

How so?

“The state of Massachusetts gives healthcare to illegal immigrants…”

This is a big problem everywhere; I just want someone to explain to me why we can’t just gather them up and take them back where they belong?

“Abortion - the body inside the woman is not her body.”

I agree with that statement but that’s about as far as I’ll go. The woman’s body is STILL her body. Her pregnancy does NOT take away what is hers.

“It is a living organism within her and she has no rights over that life she 'carries.”

Let me get this strait; if the child is inside of her she holds no rights over it, but once it is born she does? That makes no sense. Anyway; does the child hold rights on its mother? If a woman gets pregnant does she lose the rights she had before even in cases of rape?

“It is not her body but the body of another who has the same rights as every human.”

I have many rights yet I have not found any that grant me rights over another person.

“As Scia says,when 'officially' conceived the egg has a full set of genetic markers. The egg transforms from dormant to living.”

Okay let’s say those few cells are actually a life… When do those cells start caring whether or not they are alive?

“When one aborts a baby it is murder. How can it be called justifiable? It cannot!”

Even in cases of rape? How can it be justifiable for a rape victim to be raped again?

“Know up front that many who are not Christians will get angry with you for even mentioning the name of Jesus Christ.”

This does not bother me in the least.

“This anger stems from the fact that those who are lost, deep, deep, down, know that something is missing in their life.”

This actually does piss me off. You don’t even really know me and yet somehow you’ve got this supernatural ability to tell me something is missing in my life? Well I think you are missing something in your life too Omd; the ability to discern reality from fantasy. I was eating at my brother’s place last week and his sister in law was there. She is a die hard Christian. She also thinks god and Jesus is the same person. Anyway we were discussing religion and I was making a point to my mother about the universe not being finely tuned for life when she started crying. I asked her why she was crying and she told me it’s because I won’t be able to live forever with her in heaven. I let her calm down and told her that I don’t want to live forever. What would be the point of living if we were immortal?

“This is why people get involved with drugs, with alcohol, with gambling,
with sex, or become addicted to work and success.”

I ask you to verify this claim. I want proof that atheists are more likely to get involved with these activities than Christians. Until then it’s BS and I will ask you not to mention it again.

5:36 AM, October 05, 2009  

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