Thursday, November 15, 2007

Boston Globe celebrates homosexual school clubs persuading kids to "come out" as teenagers (and earlier).

MassResistance did a great job with a recent article that appeared this past Sunday, November 11th, in the Boston Globe Sunday Magazine. The article, by a lesbian activist teacher, Alison Lobron, describes the history of homosexual activism in Massachusetts schools and how young school-aged students can take part in the dangerous lifestyles of homosexuality with the help of their teachers and school clubs.

Read full article HERE.
You must read the whole article to understand the evil mist that is suffocating our children under the school bell. Children questioning their sexuality at 6, such as Kristi Freedman? SIX years-old!!?? What was Kristi's upbringing like? Was it similar to Dawn Stefanowicz's upbringing as described in her new book Out From Under (above post)? What if Kristi had an upbringing that was entrenched in the word of God, would her sexual preferences be different than they are today? What if non-religious straight clubs surrounded Kristi at school, would her choices be different today?
What are the benefits of "when the gay hat(s) keep going on and off"? Why is there such a struggle with sexual orientation choices? What fosters them? What types of childhood upbringings result in children being confused about their sexual identities? How can WE ALL help?
This article was a wake-up call to all parents regarding what the militiant and radical homosexual community wants and is doing to our children. One question to all parents:
Are you fed-up yet with what is being shoveled down our children's throats without your knowledge?

50 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Fruity Gay Bars"

Oh wow that's funny! I'm still laughing. lol

Ken Weaver

5:49 PM, November 15, 2007  
Blogger SCIA said...

Ken,

Yeah, I wonder how they must taste. That is pretty fun!!

7:49 AM, November 16, 2007  
Anonymous KatieKat said...

The "Fuity Gay Bars" comment was definitely funny. :D
Now on to the more serious stuff:
GSAs do not "persuade" kids to be gay. They do, however, give teens and young adults a place where they feel safe enough to be themselves. Realizing that you are queer is not an easy realization, and it comes with a lot of emotional baggage - Mostly due to social stigmatization. When you're a teenager, and just becoming a sexual being, and you realize that you are attracted to the same sex, it can be terrifying. If your parents are super-religious you may be afraid of being disowned, if your friends are homophobic you may be scared that they will beat you up (or worse), if you yourself are religious you may be afraid that God hates you - There are so many scary thoughts that go through their heads, that there is a real need for a safe space to talk them all through. Knowing that you're not alone, especially during such a vulnerable time in your life, can be the difference between happiness and depression, or even life and death. Until you've experienced that kind of vulnerability, you cannot possibly understand the need for a safe space like these.

11:11 AM, November 19, 2007  
Blogger SCIA said...

Katie,

From article:

"And Peter Atlas, the former adviser of Concord-Carlisle's Spectrum group, says that, increasingly, gay kids who turn up at his classroom aren't only asking questions about coming out and getting support. "They want to know where they can meet boys!" he says with a laugh."

Yeah, these "support groups" are very productive.

Let me ask you (Being very serious and not sarcastic!!): What are the benefits of talking about anal sex with 15 year-old boys during these group discussions? Anything.....??

2:26 PM, November 20, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Did you read the same article that I did? I didn't see anything about discussing anal sex with 15 year olds? Or did you attend a BAGLY meeting recently and hear this exact discussion?

As Katie said, these groups are helpful. They don't try to force or persuade kids to be gay--they just convey the message that it's ok to be gay. Teens are insecure in general and any support that they get is vital.

Earlier generations had the same feelings, they just didn't have anywhere to express them and to feel safe.

I would think that it's much better to be supportive to these gay teens as opposed to telling them that they should be ashamed and scared of their same-sex attractions--which I'm guessing would be your helpful and loving tactic.

Again, my sense is that you aren't in the least bit concerned what would truly be helpful to these gay teens. "Oh, but if they found Jesus and just prayed their same-sex attractions away, they'd be so much happier." Yeah, right. That seems to be quite successful I hear.

-Gary

9:07 PM, November 20, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Are you fed-up yet with what is being shoveled down our children's throats without your knowledge?"

No, because I am involved in my children's lives enough to know first hand what our schools are teaching. Teaching kids about other ways of life doesn't change the values we have instilled.

2:38 PM, November 22, 2007  
Blogger SCIA said...

Gary,

You said:

"I didn't see anything about discussing anal sex with 15 year olds?"

A homosexual group meets and helps boys meet other boys...what are the two boys going to do with each other besides hold hands and give little kisses to each other...play yatzee??? No, not all of the children will engage in unnatural sexual acts, but many will after a period of time and it will be deemed "O.K.".

You said:

"As Katie said, these groups are helpful. They don't try to force or persuade kids to be gay--they just convey the message that it's ok to be gay."

Have you attended a BAGLY meeting before Gary? I have not, but can tell you WHY the groups meet and it is not just to say being a homosexual is "O.K.". It is to convey a direct message that engaging in immoral sexual behavior is O.K.....so the message of: a boy can engage in anal sex with another boy, and a girl can do whatever lesbians do to each other and this is said to be "O.K." Will ALL the children engage in these sexual activities right away...maybe not...but they are receiving the message that if they do, it is O.K....You follow??

Let's put the puzzle together:

1. Group conveys message that being homosexual is O.K. (You have agreed on this point).

2. Male or female child listens to this message, agrees, and takes part in either anal sex, or lesbian sex...sounds like a great supportive group for CHILDREN???!!!

8:15 PM, November 22, 2007  
Blogger SCIA said...

Anonymous,

You said:

"Teaching kids about other ways of life doesn't change the values we have instilled."

Maybe not, but is sure relays a pretty confusing message, especially one that is considered abnormal in our society.

In what state do your kids attend school Anonymous?

8:18 PM, November 22, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i think perhaps the reason this article came out, and the reason GSAs are becoming more popular around the world are because the world is becoming a new place, where people, especially those who are growing up and just discovering themselves, can actually feel accepted and not widely persecuted like it used to be. There's still hate and there will always still be hate. And the people who hate are just doing what they think is right. But this article gave a new generation a little hope.
Many, many gay and lesbian youth and adults, for that matter believe in God. Some are very devout to their religions. However I think that is irrelevant.
-K

3:50 AM, November 26, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

How about...... live and let live???

3:42 PM, November 26, 2007  
Blogger Tyler Dawbin said...

Yes, and leave our children alone! Stop trying to sell them homosexuality, and maybe you would find less opposition.

The interesting thing is...in this article, it says exactly what we've been saying. The kids today are growing up with legal gay marriage, so they don't even know any different - or should I say, they don't know any better.

6:55 PM, November 27, 2007  
Blogger Tyler Dawbin said...

After all, this year's high school freshmen were in elementary school when gays began to marry in Massachusetts; for them, gay marriage is more status quo than radical. Most of today's high school students weren't even born in 1989, the year the US Department of Health and Human Services reported that gay and lesbian teens were two to three times more likely to attempt suicide than straight teens, sparking a wave of activism that has made many schools more tolerant places - and taught parents how to support gay children.

Shocking.

6:57 PM, November 27, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I hear many of you saying that homosexual marriage is bad for children; I’ve always disagreed so we end at an impasse. But today I read about a 14 year old boy who died because he believed that the procedure for saving his life would make him “unclean.” Here is PROOF that religion is far worse for kids than the supposed damage that may be caused by being raised in a family without a mother or father. So why don’t you people who are so worried about what homosexual marriage might do, do something that WILL benefit kids;

STOP TEACHING THEM RELIGION!!

Ken Weaver

8:36 AM, November 30, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22032266/wid/11915773?gt1=10613

Ken Weaver

8:37 AM, November 30, 2007  
Blogger Tyler Dawbin said...

Ken, that was a Jehovah's Witness - not a Christian.

There's a difference, in that they don't actually believe that Jesus was God. They believe He was an angel, specifically the archangel Michael. That's the start of where their theology goes wrong, it just spirals from there.

7:54 AM, December 03, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

“Ken, that was a Jehovah's Witness - not a Christian.

There's a difference, in that they don't actually believe that Jesus was God.”

They’re Christians Tyler.. just not your kind of Christian; they still believe Christ died on the cross so mankind could be forgiven of their sins.

The point I’m making is that religion isn’t satisfied with existing, it needs. It needs money, blind devotion, blood and who knows what else. I just want to know why religion must indoctrinate the children like the boy I mentioned above. The poor kid never had a chance to experience life (not that he would have being religious and all.) Religion has this boy’s blood on its hands. Not just Christianity or Hindu or Muslim but religion overall. I would even be willing to bet he had his foreskin lopped off to make religion feel better. Religion feels it must “perfect” god’s creation because god apparently didn’t make it perfect enough. When will mankind see? Or maybe I have to ask when will god see? It is situations like this that force me to refuse to believe in god at all.

Ken Weaver

1:24 PM, December 03, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Scia,
I have not attended a BAGLY meeting before and neither have you. But I have spoken with teachers who are involved and they say that it is a very positive experience for gay youth.

You’re right, the group does convey that it’s ok to be gay. I think that this is great. These teens don’t have to grow up feeling isolated anymore. And you (because of your interpretation of the Bible) believe that being gay and “gay sex” in innately immoral. I do not. So, there’s no point in discussing this particular matter any further.

What BAGLY does that I support is that they provide support and others to confide, etc for gay youth. They also provide education and opportunities for gay youth to safely socialize (as all teens desperately want). Not having been to a BAGLY meeting and not being totally familiar with all of their policies, I’m not going to say that I support every single thing that they do, but overall I’m very glad that they exist.

This is a positive message that affirms self-worth, unlike the negative, condemning, hurtful messages that many (but thankfully not all) Christians convey.

And Tyler, no one is trying to “sell” someone homosexuality. Being gay is not a cult that tries to recruit members. Organizations like BAGLY and other gay rights organizations are only telling people of all ages that it’s ok to be gay. They don’t want someone who isn’t gay to become gay. That’s both foolish and impossible.

Also, you could say the same thing to the Christian right about leaving children alone. They could choose to stop telling gay youth (who may be already struggling with being gay and their overall self image) that it is innately wrong being gay. This is what leads many gay youth to being more likely to be depressed or even commit suicide. Conveying such messages to gay youth is just making them feel that they are innately wrong. Gee, what a comforting message to send to teens, who are generally insecure for the most part.

I went to the BAGLY website (I’m sure that you haven’t) and found a few testimonials. It sounds pretty positive to me. Sorry to disappoint you. Here are some excerpts:

TESTIMONIAL 1:
BAGLY has made me feel comfortable with my sexuality. I no longer feel like an outcast, because the people around me have similar thoughts and ideas. I have made new friends, and started a strong support system. There is always someone to talk to at BAGLY.

TESTIMONIAL 2:
In Massachusetts LGBT young people are over 5 times as likely as their straight peers to attempt suicide (2003 Massachusetts Youth Risk Behavior Survey). They are also more likely to report being harassed at school, bring a weapon to school, and have feelings of loneliness, isolation, and depression.

I am a survivor of those grim statistics. In my rural Pennsylvanian high school I was subjected to severe verbal and physical harassment. My locker, desks, and school projects were vandalized. I gave and received black eyes regularly. Once, a boy gripped my throat so tight that I fainted. My guidance counselor suggested that I try “not walking around like a sad puppy dog.” I had no openly gay teachers, friends, or family members. My school had no gay straight alliance, and my community had no support groups for LGBT people.

Fortunately I escaped the torment when Emerson College accepted me as a student. I was in eleventh grade, and had no high school diploma. But the college understood my plea for help. Once in Boston my life began to turn around with the kind-hearted aid of organizations like SpeakOut!, PFLAG, and especially BAGLY.

BAGLY aided me, like countless other youth, in my transition from a shy fearful person to a strong and confident young leader. In the past four years of my volunteering and working for this organization, I have seen hundreds of young people turn their lives around. I have seen youth without health care find it. I have seen suicidal youth get the support they need. And I’ve seen youth who were kicked out of their homes, find the resources to survive.

BAGLY has made an impact on thousands of Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Youth.
[End of testimonials]

This sounds like these gay young people became more confident and didn’t feel like outcasts anymore. This is what every teen wants. I feel bad for gay youth who have parents and other adults around them who make them feel so bad about themselves, just because they’re attracted to others of the same sex.

Oh, and you (Scia) said at one point that you weren’t condemning homosexuality. This indicates to me that you unfortunately may not realize how you come across. To condemn is to “disapprove” (according to one dictionary that I found). I think it’s overwhelming clear that you “disapprove” of homosexuality. (Even this statement is somewhat illogical to me but that’s another discussion that I won’t start). And no, you are not just pointing out dangerous behaviors, because there are dangerous behaviors associated with both straight and gay people. As people like Katie attest to, you can live a perfectly healthy and happy life as a gay person.

-Gary

9:45 AM, December 04, 2007  
Anonymous KF said...

Gary -- you are fabulous and have put into words EXACTLY what needs to be said.

11:42 AM, December 04, 2007  
Blogger Tyler Dawbin said...

Ken, a Christian believes in Jesus Christ as the Son of God.

Jehovah's Witnesses are not Christians. Mormons are close, but not quite...as they say that Jesus and Satan are brothers, and they take away from the Deity of Christ.

It is impossible to believe that Jesus has the power to forgive your sins and that He is worthy of your worship and praise if you make Him anything other than the incarnate God.

9:41 AM, December 05, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

“Ken, a Christian believes in Jesus Christ as the Son of God.”

So Catholics aren’t Christians even though they can trace their history to one of Jesus’ apostles? Protestant Christians can only trace their history to a British King that wanted to get a divorce so he made his own religion. Which could be more accurate? I find it odd that you’d argue for the definition of Christian, when you’ll not fight to keep Christ’s name from getting a bad rap when it’s in danger of becoming once again related to those we see now as unjust.

“…they say that Jesus and Satan are brothers, and they take away from the Deity of Christ.”

How else would Satan have so much power that he could actually tempt Christ/god?

“It is impossible to believe that Jesus has the power to forgive your sins and that He is worthy of your worship and praise if you make Him anything other than the incarnate God.”

Mormon, Catholic and other Christ believing religions would argue that god took out his anger on Christ so we would not have to face that wrath. Yes I know that sounds silly, but to me believing Christ was actually god sounds silly too.

Ken Weaver

5:48 PM, December 05, 2007  
Blogger Tyler Dawbin said...

That’s both foolish and impossible.

Really? Tell that to the men locked up in prison.

Gary, I understand what you are trying to convey, but you and I don't see these things the same way. The most loving thing that a struggling child can be told is that they are loved unconditionally by their parents - and if they aren't, shame on the parents - and that the parents are willing to do anything to help that child.

What BAGLY and other organizations do is they glorify the homosexual lifestyle as if it is one of sheer joy and happiness. They do indeed do this, and it is indeed a lie. All ways of living are frought with difficulties, and that especially holds true for people who struggle with their sexuality.

Children that I work with have told me that a group came to their school, and as part of the message they were told, "If someone calls you gay, thank them for the compliment!"

What kind of impression is that supposed to leave on a child? Are they being told that they should thank someone for calling them STRAIGHT?

Sadly, in our schools, the only view that is tolerated by the oh-so-tolerant=-left is the one that their agenda trumps all others. Any other viewpoint is silenced. Just look what has happened to PFOX and similar organizations when they have tried to go into schools. It is impossible for them to have a presence to provide children with the help some of them desperately need, because they are shouted down and called bigots, accused of spreading lies and hate, and told that there is no such thing as an ex-gay.

Truth be known, there are tens - maybe even hundreds - of thousands of ex-gays, a message that isn't tolerated by the left (and BAGLY, and PFLAG, etc.).

Children need to be correctly informed, and I think that is the point that people like SCIA and myself are trying to make.

5:00 AM, December 06, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Tyler,
Men in prison don’t change their sexual orientation when they have sex with men (they’re still attracted to women). I’m sure that they would much, much rather be having sex with women than with each other, but that’s the only option obviously. Unless you’ve asked a man who has been in prison and had sex with another man, you don’t know what they were thinking during the act. Gay men can have sex with women but that doesn’t mean that they’re now straight obviously.

Again, I’m guessing that you haven’t been to a BAGLY meeting (right?) so I don’t know how you can say that they say that they “glorify” being gay. What they do is offer acceptance and support and show that you can be genuinely happy being gay--which is true. I’ve never met someone who’s gay who has not had some struggles or difficulties because of this. (Of course these struggles would be minimized greatly if more people just accepted them for who they are) so I would find it hard to believe that BAGLY meetings don’t deal with these challenges.

You said:
Children that I work with have told me that a group came to their school, and as part of the message they were told, “If someone calls you gay, thank them for the compliment!”

What kind of impression is that supposed to leave on a child? Are they being told that they should thank someone for calling them STRAIGHT?”

The point that the person was making is that being called “gay” shouldn’t have a negative connotation. And he was advising that if someone calls you “gay” that you should let them know in some way that being called gay isn’t an insult. The “thanks for the compliment” phrasing isn’t really clear though and may not be the best phrase to use, but I see what the person was getting at.

And I don’t have any sympathy for people wanting to make sure that children in public schools are told that being gay is wrong. This is primarily an agenda based on religious beliefs and does not belong in our PUBLIC school system.

As far as the whole ex-gay thing goes. There have been so many stories of how damaging ex-gay programs are. Go to this clip:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=hxDN_VMt4aY

And here’s a recent story about this as well.
http://www.pegasusnews.com/news/2007/dec/14/dallas-gay-man-adversely-affected-christian-purity/

And I noticed that Scia never responded to my last post on “Mentally Molested.”

-Gary

8:31 AM, December 17, 2007  
Anonymous omd said...

It's the sexual behavior, the sexual behavior, the sexual behavior that is the crux of the matter NOT whether someone aligns themselves with the homosexual community, NOT whether someone FEELS attraction or PREFERS the company of one of the same gender.

It is the act, the sexual behavior that is deviant and it's not just homosexual sexual behavior that falls into the deviant column. Sexual relations are for married heteroseuals to procreate, i.e. the survival of the species.

For those that call themselves Christian, whether homosexual or not GOD says homosexual behavior is SIN. He teaches ALL sex outside of heterosexual marriage is SIN.

SO, in my mind, you might FEEL a certain way but YOU choose whether or not to ACT upon your feeling. Strictly YOUR choice... No one else's... YOURS ALONE!

Men performing oral on men is wrong. Men engaing in anal sex is wrong. Women performing oral on women is wrong. It is sin and sin is wrong.

Just because you FEEL a certain way doesn't mean you have to ACT on it. You are what you are by nature. You might be a thief by nature BUT it is a choice you make to engage in theft. You might be a liar by nature BUT it is a choice you make to engage in lying. You might be a murderer by nature BUT is is a choice you make to engage in murder. You might be a cheater by nature BUT it is a choice you make to engage in cheating.

So, you might be a homosexual by nature or choice BUT it is YOUR choice whether or not you engage in homosexual sexual behavior. No one is forcing the homosexual to behave in that manner, just as no one is forcing the thief to steal or the liar to lie or the cheater to cheat or the murderer to kill. We all sin by choice.

All Jesus ever did was to tell people to go and sin no more. He knew that we don't have the ability to change ourselves, our natures, without the help of a savior. We cannot change our nature BUT we can change our behavior with God's assistance.

We all need to Go and Sin No More.

4:51 PM, December 17, 2007  
Anonymous KatieKat said...

Okay, OMD, so if I live by your rules, and never have sex with the love of my life again (which, as I've said before, wouldn't make a difference), THEN can I marry her? If we agree to not 'engage in homosexual acts', THEN can my family be recognized as such? If it is as you say, than I should be able to have my marriage validated as long as I don't have sex with my wife, right?
*This is utterly ridiculous*

7:35 AM, December 18, 2007  
Anonymous omd said...

You are right, this is utterly ridiculous. Your premise is that you HAVE to have sex. Like it's being forced on you and you have no choice. Everything we do is by our choice.

Yet, even so, homosexual sexual behavior produces nothing and can never produce anything. Whether we like it or not, sexual relations were/are intended for the production of off-spring and the only way for that to happen is through a male & female interaction.

Sorry Katie, marriage was intended to be between a man and a woman, only, not a woman & a woman or a man & a man.

With my utmost respect towards you, we are not talking of 'family' here. This seems to be the tactic that people always use to escape or avoid the behavior issue.

There are many family style structures out there that are not predicated on marriage or sexual relations.

Katie, when you say 'validated' I hear, government stamp of approval for homosexual behavior. Just like giving a disease civil rights status. What do YOU mean by validated in the context you were using it?

Katie, if you want to live with another woman and engage in what God and society considers to be unnatural and deviant sexual practices...well, That's your choice. BUT, please do not impregnate the rest of the world, through coercive measures, with the homosexual desire for "legal" acceptance of a behavior considered to be unnatural & deviant.

Live your life of choice in peace but please don't... well, maybe we can take a page from the military. Don't ask don't tell.

You and I don't seem to agree and I want you to know that I hold no disdain or animosity towards you.

7:19 PM, December 21, 2007  
Anonymous KatieKat said...

"Your premise is that you HAVE to have sex."
Nope, I've already said that it wouldn't matter if I never had it again. So, you're way off here.
"Yet, even so, homosexual sexual behavior produces nothing and can never produce anything."
So? What does that have to do with anything? Even if I were straight, I would not be having sex in orderr to beget children, as I have absolutely NO desire to have any more. Further, by saying this, you're saying that ANY sex that isn't intended to produce children is wrong. I would have to respectfully disagree with that.
"Sorry Katie, marriage was intended to be between a man and a woman"
Says who? Prove it.
"What do YOU mean by validated in the context you were using it?"
I don't need anyone's 'approval' for my 'lifestyle' (as you call it), the only approval or affirmation I need is from God. However, by belittling my family structure, you not only infer that my family is INvalid, but you are hurting my daughter by doing so. She has the right to feel that her family is just as important and valid as yours.
"please do not impregnate the rest of the world, through coercive measures, with the homosexual desire for "legal" acceptance of a behavior considered to be unnatural & deviant."
First of all, not everyone feels that my 'behavior' (as you call it) is 'unnatural & deviant'. Second of all, who are you to judge? Who are you to say that my love isn't just as deep as anyone else's? I could not force myself to love a man even if I tried (and believe me, I have), but I have fallen in love, truly, madly, and deeply with a woman that I will spend the rest of my life with. Someone who creates a feeling of deep, abiding, uncompromised joy in my life. Who are you to tell me that it's wrong? All I (and other queer people) want is to have our families protected in the same ways that yours is. Somehow, I just don't think that is too much to ask.
"You and I don't seem to agree and I want you to know that I hold no disdain or animosity towards you."
I'm glad to hear it. The feeling is mutual.
I hope everyone had a wonderful Christmas/Winter Solstice/Saturnalia Holiday.

8:36 AM, December 26, 2007  
Anonymous omd said...

You said ~ "I don't need anyone's 'approval' for my 'lifestyle' (as you call it)",...

Reply -
As a member of the homosexual community are you saying that you do not support the homosexual agenda with regards to attaining government approval of homosexual sexual behavior through the institution of marriage?

You, Cont'd "...the only approval or affirmation I need is from God."

Reply -
I guess I need to ask which God you seek approval from? The Judeo/Christian God or some other god? If it's the Judeo/Christian God you will not find approval of homosexual sexual behavior from Him.

You wrote ~ "Further, by saying this, you're saying that ANY sex that isn't intended to produce children is wrong."

Reply -
No, you are saying that, but I'll be clearer. The only time sexual acts are not wrong behavior, is when it is consentual between a husband(male) & wife(female).

I wrote & then you challenged -
"Sorry Katie, marriage was intended to be between a man and a woman"

You - "Says who? Prove it."

Me - the God you seek approval from. It is written in the Bible. Please define what you mean by affirmation as I see it as simply seeking approval.

You -
"However, by belittling my family structure, you not only infer that my family is INvalid, but you are hurting my daughter by doing so. She has the right to feel that her family is just as important and valid as yours."

Me - I have not belittled your family structure. I believe I stated that there are all kinds of family structures out there that are not predicated on an unnatural sexual act and by teaching your daughter that it is ok smacks of parental irresponsibility.

The rights you seek can be legislated without forcing an unnatural behavior onto the rest of the world or innocent children.

Katie, I regret using the term deviant as it is a caustic word and hurts the dialogue.

I am not the one telling you homosexual sexual behavior is wrong. God is. I am only sharing the words God has shared with us that are written in the scriptures.

Again, the rights and protections for your family can be legislated.

Unfortunately that is not what the homosexual community leaders want.

I had spoken with my legislators about the introduction of legislation
that would give equal protection to all families without making homosexual sexual behavior a protected behavior. We saw what the homosexual community really wants during the debates with the state legislators.

With marriage comes natural & legitimate sexual behavior. Thus, saying or implying that homosexual sexual practices now are legitimate.[thanks to the Goodrich decision and the State Legislature] This is what it has always been about, isn't it? All the other stuff has been the smoke screen surrounding approval of an unnatural sexual behavior

8:52 PM, December 28, 2007  
Anonymous KatieKat said...

Respectfully, I have to disagree with you. I am also having a really hard time figuring out why you keep mentioning 'sexual behavior'. What does sex have to do with it? Sex has absolutely nothing to do with why I would like the right to visit my wife in the hospital. Sex has nothing to do with why I want her to have the right to raise our daughter should something happen to me. Sex has nothing to do with why I want to be able to file my taxes jointly. I'm not sure why so many anti-SSM folks are so focused on my sex life. I don't think about your sex life, why do you feel the need to obsess about mine?
Further, you continue to mention that (your) God says that homosexuality is wrong. Could you please provide me with these so-called 'scriptures', that unequivocally state that my relationship is sinful?

7:39 AM, December 31, 2007  
Anonymous omd said...

Hi and Happy New Year

I'm more than happy to lead you to the scriptures that say your the sexual behavior practiced in your "relationship" is sinful. And I will do so after you have answered the questions I asked you.

1. "I guess I need to ask which God you seek approval from? The Judeo/Christian God or some other god?"

2. "As a member of the homosexual community are you saying that you do not support the homosexual agenda with regards to attaining government approval of homosexual sexual behavior through the institution of marriage?"

3. "With marriage comes natural & legitimate sexual behavior. Thus, saying or implying that homosexual sexual practices now are legitimate.[thanks to the Goodrich decision and the State Legislature] This is what it has always been about, isn't it?"

Katie, it's not your overall relationship that's the issue. It's the sexual nature of your relationship that is unnatural and is why there seems to be a focus on that behavior, Especially when children are involved.

Two of the Three things you have asked for can be legislated.

You wrote:
I would like the right to visit my wife in the hospital...

I want her to have the right to raise our daughter should something happen to me...

Katie, I requested, from my legislators that they pass legislation giving homosexuals the right to visit and to inherit and provide care for.

THEY REFUSED!!

You see, these supposed rights were NOT what the ultimate goal was among the homosexual community. The goal was, and still is, to obtain government approval of a sexual behavior.

By the changing of the definition of "legal" marriage the homosexual community now says that their sexual behavior is legitimate and a natural act.

I'll give you one area. Start at Romans chapter 1 verse 18 - 26. This states that these homosexual acts are unnatural and thus wrong.

Oh, by-the-way sex has everything to do with the things you question. I've already stated that ALL sexual acts outside the boundries of marriage, i.e. between a man & a woman, are sinful thus wrong. It even ventures into sexual thoughts can be sinful outside the parameters of marriage, between 1 man & 1 woman.

BUT when it comes to children it is wrong to teach them that homosexual sexual behavior is valid or ok or acceptable in the eyes of a holy God.

Katie, God loves you and wants a relationship with you. Only He can say this, He would tell you "Katie, go and sin no more" If you were in His presence you would be aware of your sin. He knows that we are unable to change ourselves WITHOUT Him. You will live your live as you see fit. We are all the beneficiaries of "free will." Thus we are each accountable before God because it is our choices that we make and act on that God will judge us on. The biggest, of course, is do we believe that Jesus is who He says He is and did we committ our lives to Him.

10:56 AM, January 02, 2008  
Anonymous KatieKat said...

1. "I guess I need to ask which God you seek approval from? The Judeo/Christian God or some other god?"
I do not 'seek' approval from any God(dess). I have it. I would not have been made this way if I didn't. Moreover, I do not differentiate between the Judeo/Christian God, the Hindu God, the B'Hai God, or any others. God is God is God.
2. "As a member of the homosexual community are you saying that you do not support the homosexual agenda with regards to attaining government approval of homosexual sexual behavior through the institution of marriage?"
I want to be married to the woman I love. I really don't care who 'approves' of it. I want to go into my church, have a beautiful ceremony, have a fantastic reception, and go on my honeymoon. When I'm all done, I want the right to jointly file my taxes with my wife. Once again, none of which has anything to do with sex. Moreover, the only thing that 'condemns' my 'sexual behavior', is your Bible. Why would the government, or anyone else for that matter, need to heed what your Bible says? You can believe whatever you want, but you have to leave your religious beliefs where they belong: in your home, or at your church. What I really would like for you to explain to me is why I cannot be civilly (as in, not religiously) married.
3. "With marriage comes natural & legitimate sexual behavior. Thus, saying or implying that homosexual sexual practices now are legitimate.[thanks to the Goodrich decision and the State Legislature] This is what it has always been about, isn't it?"
Like I said above, no, it's not. This is about being considered my wife's next of kin. This is about the legal protections afforded to those, like you, who just happened to have been born attracted to the opposite sex. I want those protections, too, and I don't think it's an unreasonable request.
"BUT when it comes to children it is wrong to teach them that homosexual sexual behavior is valid or ok or acceptable in the eyes of a holy God."
My daughter is being raised by two loving, devoted parents. She is luckier than most. Not only that, but she is being raised knowing without a doubt that both of her parents love each other. I don't think that is a bad thing.
"I'll give you one area. Start at Romans chapter 1 verse 18 - 26. This states that these homosexual acts are unnatural and thus wrong."
I read those verses, in several different versions of the Bible. I cannot find anything condemning committed, loving gay couples. Maybe you could clarify? All I read about were people who worshipped idols instead of God, and were punished for it.
"Oh, by-the-way sex has everything to do with the things you question. I've already stated that ALL sexual acts outside the boundries of marriage, i.e. between a man & a woman, are sinful thus wrong."
As someone who is deeply spiritual and religious, I definitely have to disagree with you here. Care to try and prove it? :)
Happy New Year to you and yours, as well.

1:03 PM, January 02, 2008  
Anonymous Rufus said...

Happy New Year to All!

"You see, these supposed rights were NOT what the ultimate goal was among the homosexual community. The goal was, and still is, to obtain government approval of a sexual behavior."

Why all this focus on "sexual behavior". From what I understand, no one is asking for approval of a behavior. Gays are asking to be treated equally in reguard to their commited relationships, in the halls of our government. Civil marriage achieves this.

Why is it gay couples are only looked upon as something merely sexual? When one sees a straight married couple, there isn't usually an automatic thought of what they do in bed. Why the focus on what gays and lesbians do in bed? Sex between two consenting adults is really no ones business but their own.

OMD, can't you understand it's not the sanctioning of a sexual behavior, but of relationships. I know gay couples who are more in love, more committed and better matches than many staight couples I know. This does not make their relationships better or worse, just different.

9:05 AM, January 03, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great post Rufus!!

Ken Weaver

5:27 PM, January 03, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I just happened upon this blog and have been reading the posts.

What a collection of buffoons.

This guy Weaver talks in circles and says nothing

KatieKat why don't you address the questions? They've been asked and clarified but you always put your own little spin to avoid the premise.

Rufus, do think that pedophilia behavior is ok?

Do you think two guys performing oral & anal on each other is normal?

Do you think two women strapping on devices or performing oral on each other is normal?

How about S&M is that ok too?

These are all sexual behaviors. So, who decides what sexual behavior is ok?
You? KatieKat? OMD? Scia? Weaver? Tyler? Gary?

There are more than just the Bible that says homosexual sexual behavior is wrong. It has been considered immoral, although performed, for centuries. So what makes it ok today? Oh ya, we're more enlightened, right?

Live your lives the way you want but KEEP IT AWAY FROM THE KIDS!! This blog has certainly done a good job in exposing how pervasive sexual immorality is within our culture and those that defend that immorality should be... I don't know, it's just sickening.

What a collection of buffoons

1:09 PM, January 04, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

“This guy Weaver talks in circles and says nothing”

Really? Why don’t you point it out to me?

“These are all sexual behaviors. So, who decides what sexual behavior is ok?”

I believe in freedom. I believe that no one alive has the moral wisdom to decide morality for others when those choices create no victims. The pilgrims that came here in the late 1400’s and early 1500’s came here for freedom, they just couldn’t offer that freedom to those with a different skin color. The soldiers that fought in the Revolutionary war fought for freedom. The idea of freedom is greater than any other idea ever; including religion. We call America the land of the free and home of the brave, not the land of Christ and the home of the faithful.

“There are more than just the Bible that says homosexual sexual behavior is wrong.”

Without using religious texts or religious views it says somewhere that homosexuality is wrong? I’d really like to know where.

“…those that defend that immorality should be... I don't know…”

I don’t defend what I see as immorality. I say it’s immoral to demand religious adherence from people who don’t believe in it. I say it’s immoral to mutilate the genitalia of children for one’s religious beliefs. I believe it is immoral to deem other’s victimless actions as immoral. There are very few Christians I admire, because most seem to believe they have a right to decide morality fore the rest of us. They keep telling me that it’s not “their” judgments but god’s; all I can say is let god handle it then.

“What a collection of buffoons”

Maybe, but who are you to decide?

Ken Weaver

8:24 PM, January 04, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Take your pick. Which ones do you want your kids exposed to?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

What Is A ‘Sexual Orientation’? There are 30 different categories of “sexual orientation!!”

The American Psychiatric Association (APA), which is dominated by homosexual activists, publishes a huge document called the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-IV-R). This manual is used by psychiatrists and other mental health workers to define various mental illnesses. This is their list of 30 “sexual orientations.”

Apotemnophilia - sexual arousal associated with the stump(s) of an amputee

Asphyxophilia - sexual gratification derived from activities that involve oxygen deprivation through hanging, strangulation, or other means

Autogynephilia - the sexual arousal of a man by his own perception of himself as a woman or dressed as a woman (p. 574)

Bisexual - the capacity to feel erotic attraction toward, or to engage in sexual interaction with, both males and females

Coprophilia - sexual arousal associated with feces (p. 576)

Exhibitionism - the act of exposing one’s genitals to an unwilling observer to obtain sexual gratification (p. 569)

Fetishism/Sexual Fetishism -obtaining sexual excitement primarily or exclusively from an inanimate object or a particular part of the body (p. 570)

Frotteurism - approaching an unknown woman from the rear and pressing or rubbing the penis against her buttocks (p. 570)

Heterosexuality - the universal norm of sexuality with those of the opposite sex.

Homosexual/Gay/Lesbian - people who form sexual relationships primarily or exclusively with members of their own gender

Gender Identity Disorder - a strong and persistent cross-gender identification, which is the desire to be, or the insistence that one is, or the other sex, "along with" persistent discomfort about one’s assigned sex or a sense of the inappropriateness in the gender role of that sex (p. 576)

Gerontosexuality - distinct preference for sexual relationships primarily or exclusively with an elderly partner

Incest - sex with a sibling or parent

Kleptophilia - obtaining sexual excitement from stealing

Klismaphilia - erotic pleasure derived from enemas (p. 576)

Necrophilia - sexual arousal and/or activity with a corpse (p. 576)

Partialism - A fetish in which a person is sexually attracted to a specific body part exclusive of the person (p. 576)

Pedophilia - Sexual activity with a prepubescent child (generally age 13 years or younger). The individual with pedophilia must be age 16 years or older and at least 5 years older than the child. For individuals in late adolescence with pedophilia, no precise age difference is specified, and clinical judgment must be used; both the sexual maturity of the child and the age difference must be taken into account; the adult may be sexually attracted to opposite sex, same sex, or prefer either (p. 571)

Prostitution - the act or practice of offering sexual stimulation or intercourse for money

Sexual Masochism - obtaining sexual gratification by being subjected to pain or humiliation (p. 573)
Sexual Sadism - the intentional infliction of pain or humiliation on another person in order to achieve sexual excitement (p. 574)

Telephone Scatalogia - sexual arousal associated with making or receiving obscene phone calls (p. 576)

Toucherism - characterized by a strong desire to touch the breast or genitals of an unknown woman without her consent; often occurs in conjunction with other paraphilia

Transgenderism - an umbrella term referring to and/or covering transvestitism, drag queen/king, and transsexualism
Transsexual - a person whose gender identity is different from his or her anatomical gender

Transvestite - a person who is sexually stimulated or gratified by wearing the clothes of the other gender
Transvestic Fetishism - intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving cross-dressing (p. 575)

Urophilia - sexual arousal associated with urine (p. 576)

Voyeurism - obtaining sexual arousal by observing people without their consent when they are undressed or engaged in sexual activity (p. 575)

Zoophilia/Bestiality - engaging in sexual activity with animals (p. 576)

Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition, Text Revision (Washington: American Psychiatric Association, 2000), "Paraphilias," pp. 566-582

I only see one of the 30 that is considered normal behavior. All the others are mental disorders. This is what the homosexual community wants to government to pass a law saying one's sexual orientation is sacrosanct.

To do so will result in anarchy. Freedom has limits and sexual immorality should not be given protected status.

8:55 PM, January 04, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

“Take your pick. Which ones do you want your kids exposed to?”

It depends on what you mean by “exposed?” If you mean by watching the actual event I must say no. If it is to teach them the words you mentioned once my kids have reached an age of understanding what sex is …expose away.

“I only see one of the 30 that is considered normal behavior.”

Normal by whose standards?

“This is what the homosexual community wants to government to pass a law saying one's sexual orientation is sacrosanct.

To do so will result in anarchy.”

So, marriage equality will bring about anarchy? People running through the streets, rioting, etc. etc. You must think very little of yourself and of humanity to think marriage equality will bring about anarchy. Do you have so little self control? Maybe you’re right, maybe it will be Christians that won’t be able to handle the mental stress of people thinking and acting not in accordance to the bible. If that’s what will happen I say bring it on! It will only prove that religion is a mental deficiency.

“Freedom has limits and sexual immorality should not be given protected status.”

The only limit freedom should have is where your actions do not deprive anyone else their right to do as they wish with themselves or their property. Your limited view of sexual morality is the same kind of restriction that religion has tried to bind humanity with. Enough is enough! You can’t control me with your false stories and your adherence to religious tradition. Your lies about fire and brimstone frighten me no longer. Someday soon (I hope) humanity will put religion where it belongs…history.

Ken Weaver

9:54 AM, January 05, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You: "You can’t control me with your false stories and your adherence to religious tradition.Your lies about fire and brimstone frighten me no longer."

Me: First, I have no stories of fire & brimstone and have never done what you accuse me of. I have also never tried to control you either. I only know you by what you have written.

Hahahahaha, I did not use the word I wanted to convey when I used anarchy because that's not what I really meant. OOPS!

Me: “I only see one of the 30 that is considered normal behavior.”

You: "Normal by whose standards?"

By the American Psychiatric Association. Here's the ref.

Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition, Text Revision (Washington: American Psychiatric Association, 2000), "Paraphilias," pp. 566-582

Now, again, we are speaking of behaviors. Please stop avoiding that.

So, do you want your kids told that 29 of those 30 behaviors are normal even when the pros only acknowledge one as being normal? We are talking about amoral and abnormal behaviors. Remember it's not me that is saying the behaviors are not normal. It's the psychiatrists. These are the people that are trained in behavior. All I've done is show you what they say

You sir are an anarchist, in my opinion, freedom does have limits. You cannot do whatever you want. Or do you also believe that society should have no laws or boundries?

6:36 PM, January 07, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

“First, I have no stories of fire & brimstone”

Isn’t fire and brimstone what is taught to children to keep them from straying off the “righteous” path? Isn’t fire and brimstone the generally accepted view of hell?

“I did not use the word I wanted to convey when I used anarchy because that's not what I really meant.”

So…which word did you mean to use?

“So, do you want your kids told that 29 of those 30 behaviors are normal even when the pros only acknowledge one as being normal?”

I want my child to look at all things and decide normal for himself. My child is intelligent enough for that… is yours? If your child is, why would you not want him to use his mind? Do you believe god gave him that mind? Would god want your child to follow him blindly or use the brain he was given?

“freedom does have limits. You cannot do whatever you want.”

So… pretend you were our leader, what would you make a crime that has no victims? Would homosexuality be a crime? What about adultery? What should be the proper punishments? You say freedom should have limits… so enlighten me with your limitations.

Ken Weaver

8:35 PM, January 07, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

By the way anonymous, would you mind giving me something to call you? A nickname is fine if you wish to withold your identity.

Ken Weaver

8:40 PM, January 07, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jim

Sodomy is against the law.

Hell is eternal separation from God.

God gave children minds. You want a child to decide on their own without parental guidence to teach them what is right and wrong. I bet you believe there are no absolutes, too. Because you tend towards anarcy you think the way you do.

Someplace I read a great line. Maybe it was in this blog someplace. "A river without banks is nothing more than a swamp"

So, freedom without limits is really anarcy. If freedom is not limited then you would have no need for laws. BUT we do have laws because people overstep the boundries of freedom.

10:57 PM, January 20, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey Jim, nice to meet you.

“Sodomy is against the law.”

In AZ oral sex is against the law, I break it every chance I get!

“Hell is eternal separation from God.”

So that’s where we are!

“You want a child to decide on their own without parental guidence to teach them what is right and wrong.”

Not without guidance. But guidance doesn’t mean forcing them down a certain path.

“I bet you believe there are no absolutes, too.”

I absolutely believe you and I and everyone else deserves the freedom to do whatever you wish, as long as it doesn’t harm another person’s right to do as they wish.

“So, freedom without limits is really anarcy.”

I agree, that’s why the limitation is that you can’t take away another person’s rights.


“If freedom is not limited then you would have no need for laws. BUT we do have laws because people overstep the boundries of freedom.”

Yes, throughout history some people have always removed the rights of others. Religion has usually been at the forefront of limiting freedom and rarely on the side of increasing it.

“In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince men that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy man living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, man is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.”

George H. Smith

Ken Weaver

7:05 AM, January 21, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Guys, please!

What I meant by "live and let live" is... to let people be! If they are gay, fine. If they come out, fine. If they're straight, fine.

But what's the point in hating other people for who they are? What good will that do? Or pointing out that they are "wrong,", or that one may believe that God will hate groups of people... Even if you believe that's the case, even if it is your lawful right to freedom of speech... what good will it do?

Just... people should be able to be happy. Make their own choices and accept whatever consequences will come for them... if any at all.

Just... why refuse to accept eachother? What good will it do?

-K

8:35 AM, January 21, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sounds good. Sort of Rodney King(ish).

The issue, K, is that the people in this conversation do not want to address a behavior that has been considered immoral since the beginning of human history.

Also, God does not hate anyone. He allows people to act as they will even when they go against His laws. It's their choice. God loves everyone. He does not want even one to perish. There is a path to Him that must be chosen and it is through Jesus.

The other thing to remember is that Jesus, the Son, did not come for everyone, just those given to Him by God, the Father.

The issue is those that want to practice lawlessness and immorality want to throw it in everyone's face and make laws that protect their behavior. I could care less if someone choses homosexuality for a lifestyle. Discretion is the better part of valor and these folks don't want to be discreet they want to force themselves on everyone else.

- J

10:49 PM, January 22, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

“…a behavior that has been considered immoral since the beginning of human history.”

Sorry Jim but the Greeks and the Romans both had great empires that did not see homosexuality as immoral. There are numerous countries that are not as famous as those two who also did not see homosexuality as immoral. The Hebrews started that idea and it spread after Rome converted to Christianity.

“The other thing to remember is that Jesus, the Son, did not come for everyone, just those given to Him by God, the Father.”

Haven’t you figured out that I am not a believer? I don’t think it’s a good idea to ask me to follow the Christian sense of morality (especially since that morality is so immoral.)

“The issue is those that want to practice lawlessness and immorality want to throw it in everyone's face and make laws that protect their behavior.”

Maybe if Christianity and other religions would have left them alone instead of stringing them up/killing/abusing/berating them they would not feel the need to protect themselves with the law. Christians unknowingly caused this whole situation. And so did every religion that would condemn homosexuals to death or prison for being homosexual.

“Discretion is the better part of valor and these folks don't want to be discreet they want to force themselves on everyone else.”

Do you have any idea how many times I’ve said the same damn thing about religion?

Ken Weaver

6:18 AM, January 23, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Personally reading these posts so far I'd tend to agree with K and J... towards the bottom...

What do you think about the kids involved in this article? Specifically... their outlooks are all rather different.

D.A.

12:27 PM, March 27, 2008  
Blogger SCIA said...

D.A.

I personally think the kids involved in the article are indoctrinated by teachers and that therefor justifies the student's choices of engaging in homosexual acts.

It is scary how adults can sculpt a student's mind and even decisions.

1:05 PM, March 28, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"SIX years-old!!?? What was Kristi's upbringing like?"

And what is that?? You think this girl had a bad upbringing? That's absurd. So much bashing of her. It's pathetic.

-D. A.

7:30 PM, March 29, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well that seemed to shut everyone up.

8:36 AM, March 31, 2008  
Blogger SCIA said...

Anonymous,

Your funny! Yes, D.A.'s comments regarding how a 6-year-old can determine her sexual being is pretty conversation stumping.

"Well that seemed to shut everyone up."

I can't stop laughing!!!

11:39 AM, April 01, 2008  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

well did it or did it not cease this argument? it was getting fairly futile anyhow. nobody's going to sway anyone else!
and then the covergirl is mentioned and... nobody has a word to say. nice. actually, very nice.

(finally)

11:45 AM, April 01, 2008  

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